M can't make hills in 5th, could it be the weight?

Meangreen

Member
I have a 1950 Farmall M that I purchased 5 years ago. I mainly use the tractor for drives and some occasional plowing. I noticed about a year ago that the tractor seemed to have a harder time going up hills in 5th and slowing down going down hill. On flat land I can run 18 mph (according to phone gps) in 5th with no problems. I've tinkered with the carb, checked my timing and the clutch seems good.

What I'm wondering is since I purchased the tractor I've converted it from a narrow to wide front and also added 2 sets of rear wheel weights. I figure the "additions" have added around 1,000 pounds to the weight of the tractor.

Have I made it a bit too heavy for it's own good?

I could shed the wheel weights pretty easily and that would save me 500+ lbs.

Also I realize there are some hills where down shifting will be required no matter what, but on the last ride I was on a friend had a stripped down M (no weights & narrow front) and he had to down shift on 1 hill while I had to downshift on 5.
 
(quoted from post at 05:05:20 07/10/18) I have a 1950 Farmall M that I purchased 5 years ago. I mainly use the tractor for drives and some occasional plowing. I noticed about a year ago that the tractor seemed to have a harder time going up hills in 5th and slowing down going down hill. On flat land I can run 18 mph (according to phone gps) in 5th with no problems. I've tinkered with the carb, checked my timing and the clutch seems good.

What I'm wondering is since I purchased the tractor I've converted it from a narrow to wide front and also added 2 sets of rear wheel weights. I figure the "additions" have added around 1,000 pounds to the weight of the tractor.

Have I made it a bit too heavy for it's own good?

I could shed the wheel weights pretty easily and that would save me 500+ lbs.

Also I realize there are some hills where down shifting will be required no matter what, but on the last ride I was on a friend had a stripped down M (no weights & narrow front) and he had to down shift on 1 hill while I had to downshift on 5.
Maybe you need to dyno test the motor to be sure? Or the motor is getting tired and needs a ring and valve job.
 
The big variable is the hill. How can we help you evaluate something we do not know anything about? Does the tractor start easily? Does it smoke a lot? Is the engine in good shape? Yes, weight is a factor. Take the weights off and then try the hill again. That test will help answer the question. Swap out the front end and try the hill again. Now you can tell what is going on. Scientific problem solving. Change one thing at a time and run a test until you get the correct result.
sde
 
Way to much here that could be or could not be . OLd M's are like old wimmen You have no idea what is inside of them or under that BODY work. I have seen old M's that will haul the mail and others that have one foot in the grave. How they each run depends on what in them . You could have a whoppen 48 hp or ya could have one sportten 65 and up Hp. We haqve hills around here and back when we were still usen a lot of the old M's for real work they all had loaded tires and no less the three sets of donut hanging on the wheels and would drag a couple hay wagons empty up and down the hills just snortten in fifth , would pull three bottom plows in third up and down the hills , BUT they all had the over bore high dome kits and the updated timing curve in them with most running at or better then 60 hp. BUT with age and ware they do niot have the zippitydodaw they once had . Cam shafts get wore down ya got excessive play in the pieces and parts , the dist. is not doing what it should , valves out of adjustment . Being and old fart that knows how to tweak every fraction of pony power out of one helps. Tire size plays a huge roll in how well they will pull . a 13.6 or a 15.5x38 will lug better the a 14.9x38 will but the 14.9x38 you will have more ground speed . I went from a 15.5x38 to a 16.9x38 on my S/MTA and yes i have the RPM's turned up about 15% and let me tell you this ya best have your hat glued on when ya get her out on the road in fifth and open her up ,lets just say i am exceeding the SMV sigh speed limit . and it will still run up the steep hills in high fifth.
 
Agree on govenor plus check distributor advance. If your not oil fouling spark plugs an eng OH is not indicated.
 
Dad's old '51 M out in my shop has 4 inch M&W sleeves and pistons, and I find it hard to imagine the hill on a road it couldn't climb once wound-up in 5th. 600# of wheel weights and a WFE don't add enough weight to noticably effect your tractor's ability to climb hills. Dad's M climbed some pretty steep hills on the 20 mile trip to pick corn at Grandpa's 160 wearing a 2M-E picker and pulling two flare box wagons.

Try to get your M on a dyno and see what you have for horsepower. Might just need some carb tuning, maybe ignition work, adjust advance, etc.

An H I can see having to downshift on a hill, an M not pulling anything, Not so much.
 
Check your intake manifold for leaks. Doesnt take much to loose power. Maybe just retorque the manifold and see if it changes for the better.
 
Why , ya want to see a S/MTA with over 90 i can show you one , Mine is at 60 with flat tops . when one has many years at building pony power it's not hard , i can even build you a DUMPSTER engine and the only NEW parts i need is rings bearing and gskt. All done with parts others have throwen away and those have made well over 250 hp. Oh and on four cylinders .
 
I think it is just rebelling to the operators YT handle, lol. Not sure where you live must be very hilly. I don?t think there is a hill in the area that my M wouldn?t make it up in 5th. The area it resides in is NE KS which has pretty good rolling hills. Of course it does have fire craters in it. As others said probably a governor issue.
 
I grind feed with a straight M - no added power. It will run a mixer grinder with 4000 pounds of ground feed in it with no problem. And I pull a (not too huge) hill both coming and going from the bins.

They were a ?big? tractor in their day. You got something going on there. Adjust the valves, check the timing and point wear, verify the governor, and then check compression. It might be a little of this and a little of that, but those add up to power loss.
 
but if you look at that Nebraska test you will see the fuel as distillate, not gasoline most likely. And There is a big difference in HP between Gasoline vs distillate and kerosene. Lower compression engine less BTU fuel. When they got overhauled it was usually oversize pistons, higher compression, and maybe gas head.
 
That was my thought, the sound of the tractor should indicate that, correct advance gives it a staccato tone.
 
Yea BUT what advance curve is in the dist. , if it is still the old 40 degree advance that is killing him even if curb advance is at TDC . What pistons are in it ?? what head is on it . way tomany things here to say for sure as it could hae the Org. dual fuel pistons and old timing . As every once in a while you run acroos and old one that is still bone stock and never been rebuilt . And sometimes ya find some old fart that refused to upgrade to the over bore , i had one with a S/MTA that it had to be rebuilt as it came from the factory with Factory ORG parts . Hey what ever they want . He was happy TILL he bought a second S/MTA so his two boys could plow with two 4340 Oliver plows that i found for him when he sprug the J D three bottoms so bad i could not fix them . The first set he bought i was with him at a sale on a nasty day where it was all we could do was get there in my truck with the ft. hubs locked in and four wheel drive all the way and at times it took every thing the 460 had o bust thru the snow drift . In all my years i have never paid more then a cople hundred bucks for a set of drag plows till that day and this guy kept poking me to keep bidding and at the end we gave 850 bucks for a set of 4340 Oliver three bottoms , Then he demanded that i totally rebuild them with all Org. oliver parts , new moldboards new shers shins and land sides , new coulters complete and NEW tires then throw in labor and he had well over two grand in them plows , the next set i got for less and had only 1500 in them totally rebuilt. But when THE BOYS went plowing the S/MTA #2 would flat run around the Org S/MA he bought NEW he is on m case as to why the OLD one will not stay up with the NEW one , well gee you wanted org. and you got org. with the 4 inch STOCK pistons that it came with and the NEW one has 4 and 1/8th HIGH DOMES along with a M& W gov. a 450 head and 450 intake and exhaust . Just looked at him and said you wanted ORG and you got ORG. the guy that had this other one wanted MORE and GOT more , your neighbor over across the way has way more then that in his S/MTA and Vernon is pulling FOUR bottoms on the same Oliver plow you are only pulling three and Oh Billy he is doing that in third gear . Vernon's S/MTA will plum eat a GOOD running 706 ------ His is the one sporting well over 90 Hp.
 
(quoted from post at 12:10:53 07/10/18) where u getin' this 48 or 65 HP from? A new stock M was rated at 38 HP.

None of them are stock anymore.

Install the overbore kit with step-head pistons, shave the head and/or block a few thousandths just to flatten it out... These engines will easily put out 48-65HP.
 

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