So its a 6 volt system on my 450, using a 12 volt battery.

Thanks to the help given on here, and from the guy at the generator shop, it seems my 450 was originally a 6 volt system.

I took the starter back to the shop, the owner said "if its something we did wrong I'll pay for it, if its something you did then you have to pay." Seems fair.

He said it acts like the armature was split, then asked if I had been trying to get it to start? I said yes. He ended up using a shop hammer and punch to separate my starter, then showed me where the armature was split in two places and how getting it too hot causes the solder to melt and the armature to fly apart. He said over cranking causes this. I saw Lee cranking on it trying to get it to start and cautioned him not to over crank. Then I had to go to work and left until the later. Bottom line I'm paying for a new armature.

The shop owner ran the serial # on my starter and said "this is a 6 volt starter. it wont hurt to use a 12 volt battery on it, but it makes it lots easier to burn up if the motor doesn't start." He also said it would take longer to charge the battery unless someone has changed the regulator.

So, IS it an excepted practice to use a 12 volt battery on what's otherwise a 6 volt tractor? The lights have been replaced and are new type, 12 volt.
Any more fallout from the 12 volt battery in my future?

Thanks everyone for the help/guidance/wisdom.
 
12 volts on a 6 volt starter is not the issue.It wont hurt a thing,unless you just sit on it and CRANK. I have 4 old 6v IH
tractors that have been converted to 12 volt. No problems.The SM has been 12v for 30 years. The SH,over 10. Somethging else
caused your 'split' armature.
 
Reality: it is fine to use a 6v starter on 12v. The issue is that it cranks faster, and puts more amps through it. The faster cranking starts an engine way
better, usually in one or two revolutions (4 seconds). That decreases the heat buildup and wear. In our family we have at least 6 tractors and one Willis Jeep
starting on 12v with 6v starters.
The factor missing is the state of operation of the engine. Continuing to crank to get it to start is not a good choice. If a farmall is even close to correct
settings it will fire up and run. So getting it right is the first thing on the list. All starter motors are designed to have a duty cycle of about 25% of a
minute. 15 seconds on 45 seconds off. And even that needs to be extended to 15 seconds on and 2 minutes off after 2 tries to start.
I will say that, unless your tractor is going to be a show 450, putting an alternator on it is just fine and adds so much to the reliability that it is as
accepted as modern headlights. There are 12v generators you could use from the MD series, or later 450 production, if you needed to stay with the old
technology. Good luck, Jim
 
Just slap an alternator on it. I just did it this week.
My grain truck still had a generator. I bought a 10si
and it was around $55 with the core charge (that I
won't get back as I didn't have an old alternator to
turn in). The last time I had a generator rebuilt it
was $100 and I ended up taking it off two weeks
later as I couldn't get a good regulator. Lots of
things on this farm used to be 6 volt and aren't
anymore.
 
ALL my tractor have 6 volt starters on them and 12 volt battery and charging systems and have for decades.

Pretty easy to install an alternator like the one used on say a 1980 Chev pick up no power any thing no AC and be doe with it
 

My 450 WAS running like a dream, starting on the 2nd revolution every time. Idling smooth, running out nicely.
Then suddenly, it went to crap.

We left it running after installing new gauges to let it heat up, and we heard it start to bog down, run rough, then die. I think it got trash in the carb, Lee thought it was electrical. We changed the coil; it was super hot, but it still would barely run and took forever to crank.
I guess Lee cranked it so much the starter got to hot and the armature flew apart. I got a new starter button for the dash, new battery cables and ends.

We unhooked the air hose from the filter to the carb, gonna crank it and see if the air filter is clogged or the carb has trash in it. The carb drain plug is in there SOLID and we cant get it out. Because it ran so good for a while then changed I have my money on a trashed up carb.
 
We got it to run a cpl times, each time it ran very weak, wouldn't idle up, belched black smoke, sounded rich, could smell gas, choke had no effect on it. Afterward Lee pulled the plugs and they are all black and smell like gas. He's also sure the oil level has raised a little thinking it flooded so badly it got gas in the oil and made the new plugs black. Does that sound like a trashed up carb?
Lee cleaned the plugs with a propane torch and we're going to change the oil just to be safe.
 
Bad float or dirt/junk in float needle seat will cause that type of problem. Sounds like time ot pull the carb and install a kit in it. If you can shake the float and it sort of rattles it is bad or if it is dented in it is bad
 

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