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| chickensoup
08-15-2012 14:33:49
75.250.119.26
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Anyone out there have any hands on expierience with cat pony motors? I'm assembling one for a D6, I've bought new main bearings and when I install them with the oil holes and dowel pin holes lined up I have excessive crankshaft end play.
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| NCWayne
08-17-2012 06:01:40
69.40.232.132
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| What motor is the pony going on? Next week I'll be working out of town for a customer that had a factory service manual for the D333 thats in his old D6. I used it last year when I rebuilt the main engine for him and I believe it also has all of the pony motor stuff in it too. If you need something out of it just let me know, and I'll see if he'll let me bum it off of him for a day or so while I'm town.
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| chickensoup
08-17-2012 17:14:21
75.251.95.231
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to NCWayne, 08-17-2012 06:01:40
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| P.S. NCWayne, mine is a D6-8U. I'm really not sure what the main engine is. I did hear a small rumor that most pony motors are the same. Not sure, just something someone said recently.
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| Old Magnet
08-17-2012 20:33:00
76.254.44.19
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-17-2012 17:14:21
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| Main engine is a D318 on the 8U/9U series.
Pony looks similar to others but is unique to the D6 series.
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| chickensoup
08-17-2012 17:10:22
75.251.95.231
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to NCWayne, 08-17-2012 06:01:40
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| Thanks NCWayne, that would be great! I think OldMagnet got me on the right track for now, although I may need other info as I go. I see a few posts on here about mag timing. Sounds a bit tricky maybe, I guess I will find out soon enough. This is a little side project though, so I'm not setting any speed records.
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| Old Magnet
08-16-2012 19:50:55
76.254.44.19
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| | The washer butts up against the bearing to control the thrust on one direction. The crankshaft butts up against the other bearing to control the thrust in the other direction If the crankshaft thrust face is in good condition the bearing can be moved and the dowel pin and lube holes can be redrilled using the housing as a guide. Drill 15/64 and ream to 0,249-0.250 for the dowel. Thrust should be 0.010 to 0.016
Max allowable is 0.025. Another option is to make an all new bearing out of T6 aluminum that fits the conditions.
Crankshafts can also be built up to restore original clearances and fit original bearing specs.
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| chickensoup
08-17-2012 04:54:27
75.226.135.64
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to Old Magnet, 08-16-2012 19:50:55
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| Thank you oldmagnet, my thought was to drill the bearing, just thought I would ask a couple questions before doing that. Seems remotely crude, but if thats cat procedure then I will. Thanks again.
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| Old Magnet
08-17-2012 07:25:20
76.254.44.19
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-17-2012 04:54:27
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| The drill and ream procedure is the Cat method for original fitting parts. The moving and redrilling is a make do.
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| chickensoup
08-17-2012 17:04:16
75.251.95.231
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to Old Magnet, 08-17-2012 07:25:20
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| I see, as long as it works I'll do what I have to. Seems I had to move the bearing in quite alot though, I did'nt actually measure it, but I bet it was close to a quarter inch. Why so far off with original cat parts? I have no known history of this engine so I suppose it could be a mix and match from years past.
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| Old Magnet
08-17-2012 20:28:04
76.254.44.19
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-17-2012 17:04:16
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| That is excessive, must be well worn or mismatched parts. What does the thrust face on the crank look like.
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| chickensoup
08-18-2012 02:59:42
75.228.99.104
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to Old Magnet, 08-17-2012 20:28:04
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| Crank thrust face looks fine. If the pony motor is exclusive to the D6 series, I'm now wondering if this motor is from another series and that would explain why my new parts seem so far off. I should do just a little more research to make sure it will fit the machine properly. Souds like you have alot of expierience with these.
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| Old Magnet
08-18-2012 09:42:13
76.254.44.19
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-18-2012 02:59:42
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| Crankshaft part number did change from 4B2311 to 5F8405 but I don't know of any specific changes. Rest of the pony basic engine is the same, early or late. Just some of the bolt ons changed.
Yes, pretty familiar with the D6-9U's of which I have two. One is pony motor, the other direct electric start.
Not unusual to find crankshaft end play pretty far out of spec but 1/4" is pushing it.
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| dieseldr
08-16-2012 18:22:14
75.105.20.44
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| Is this one you had and tore down, or one that someone brought you, or one you never heard run before? What I'm getting at is if someone ground the thrust faces on the crank to an excessive amount to cause excessive end play.... hard telling what others have done before you got there. Most pony engines I was ever around seemed to have end play measured in inches instead of thousandths. Just my experience.
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| chickensoup
08-17-2012 05:01:18
75.226.135.64
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to dieseldr, 08-16-2012 18:22:14
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| Long story, the engine came to me in a box in pieces. Yes, it had obviously been tampered with. I inspected the crank very closely, did'nt appear to have any prior work done. The bearing did though. Thats why I bought new bearings from cat, just trying to get as close to original spec as possible. The engine on the machine has very little end ply, but a cracked block.
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| gemdozer
08-16-2012 10:14:24
69.156.161.157
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| You di't forget to reinstaled the big washer (4b2293) on rear or the washer was he to worn tickness
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| chickensoup
08-16-2012 13:20:48
75.193.186.56
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to gemdozer, 08-16-2012 10:14:24
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| I hav'nt got to that washer yet. As I said when I line up the oil holes and dowel hole the clearence is excessive. I can drive the bearing in further and take up the clearence, but then my holes are not aligned. I only have a parts manual, according to that all bearing numbers for several serial numbers are the same.
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| WayneB
08-16-2012 10:01:31
132.159.85.115
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| | Interested in a complete D-6 Pony? I converted to electric. Pulled mine, with good compression, new rebuilt carb and magneto and new gas tank & lines. On a pallet in my shop. Wayne in Virginia
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| chickensoup
08-16-2012 13:15:36
75.193.186.56
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to WayneB, 08-16-2012 10:01:31
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| I definately would be if I had'nt bought the parts! Does the electric start conversion work good?
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| WayneB
08-17-2012 05:57:41
67.142.174.22
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-16-2012 13:15:36
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| Electric start works great. The speed that my starter turns the engine is surprisingly fast. For where I live in South Central Virgina I will have little problems with the extreme cold temperatures that concern some when thinking of conversion from Pup to electric. For me it was a good choice.
Wayne
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| chickensoup
08-16-2012 08:58:16
75.193.229.0
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| End play, not journal to bearing clearance.
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| gemdozer
08-15-2012 17:22:05
69.156.161.157
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Re: D6 pony motor in reply to chickensoup, 08-15-2012 14:33:49
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| If you bought standar bearing maybe you need .020 or .o30 you need to check your main crankshaft size.
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