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Crawlers, Dozers, Loaders & Backhoes Discussion Forum

JCB Backhoe questions...

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seann

02-07-2006 16:48:03




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I just bought a JCB Backhoe and was wondering if some of you guys could help me identify it. I'm not very knowledgeable about backhoes at all, much less JCB's, so I'm hoping to get some advice on this one. The previous owner said it was a 1550B (purchased in the US) 1985 model, but she wasn't really sure. Also, I'm trying to figure out how its transmission works. It has a 4 speed with a clutch on the floor and what I guess is a forward/reverse shuttle shifter to the left of the steering wheel. It seems to pull and push hard in first gear from a standstill (as it should). But if I put it in 4th gear it seems to slip (from a standstill) until it gets up to speed. Almost feels like it might have a torque converter, but maybe it's just a hydraulically actuated clutch pack? And it seems to have an automatic style transmission dipstick, which again confuses me somewhat. And I've read some of ajk's posts in the past where I believe it was stated that these models have the same borg and warner transmission as the Case 580's had...is that true, and if it is are the parts interchangeable?

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Can someone get me started on understanding this thing? It seems like an extremely well built and powerful machine, anxious to get started with it.

Thanks...

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JV3CII

02-08-2006 15:01:25




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to seann, 02-07-2006 16:48:03  
Hi. Are you sure it's a torque converter? Memory is a little hazy but I thought these just used a standard type of hydro shuttle unit, with the pedal for inching. The clutches in most tractor shuttle units are pretty weedy (hence the slipping in 4th from a standstill?), if you belt them into a load in top gear regularly they don't tend to last very long and are worth treating a bit carefully.
Cheers, JV3CII.

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seann

02-08-2006 15:21:08




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to JV3CII, 02-08-2006 15:01:25  
I don't know if it has a torque converter. All I know is that it has a clutch pedal and if I let the clutch out in first gear while idling it jumps forward. If I do the same thing in 4th it slips but will start creeping forward while at idle. With my powershift tracked loader (which has a torque converter), if you put it in gear at idle it won't move. But as soon as you give it some gas it'll start moving (i.e. just like a car). Plus this machine has what looks just like an automatic transmission oil dipstick...so for someone who's never been around a backhoe, it's just kind of confusing. I'll sort it out eventually, I'm just a little bewildered right now.

And do you guys know if the 1550b was sold in the UK? If so does it have another nomenclature, but is otherwise the same machine?

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ajk

02-07-2006 19:15:57




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to seann, 02-07-2006 16:48:03  
Seann that is normal for that machine,it has a torque convertor coupled to a B/W shuttle box which is close coupled to a four speed manual gearbox connected by a short shaft to the axle,I could not be sure if the shuttle is exactly the same as was used in the Case but it is very similar,once the machine pushes good in first gear its ok,the shuttle has only the two clutch packs forward and reverse,on the road you should be able to shift up by pressing the pedal down and shifting at the same time,you should have a Perkins 4.236 engine,they are good machines, simple to maintain and repair,gear oil in the back axle and gearbox,ATF in the shuttle checked with the engine at low idle, 15/40 engine oil,JCB here in the UK packet their oil and call the hyd oil JCB special hyd oil,its cheaper to buy their oil than other brands and that applies to all oils battries and grease etc,any hydraulic oil like Shell Tellus will be fine,the brakes use hyd oil not brake fluid. come back if you have any problems, good luck with your investment.
AJ

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seann

02-07-2006 20:05:11




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to ajk, 02-07-2006 19:15:57  
Thanks aj, appreciate the info. So this thing has a torque converter connected to a 4 speed gearbox which also has a forward/reverse clutch pack inside it that the shuttle shifter controls. But what about the clutch pedal, how does that work? If you depress the clutch pedal does it disengage the fwd/rev clutch pack (i.e. unlock it) even if the shuttle shift lever is in forward or reverse? The thing that's sort of confusing me is that if the machine is idling and I let the clutch out in 1st gear, it will still move forward. Usually torque converters have to be revved up a bit in order for them to start transferring significant power.

And as to oils, I noticed that there are two hydraulic reservoirs inside the cab by the defroster ducts. Are these for the brakes and clutch or just brakes? I notice it has two separate brake pedals linked together, can you use differential steering on this unit? And the reservoirs say that "mineral oil" is to be used. Here in the states mineral oil is usually used as "baby oil", although I have seen Shimano mountain bike hydraulic brakes use it too. Is British "mineral oil" the same as our (US) brake fluid, or do I put real mineral oil in them? And we have several types of ATF fluid here in the states, but usually Dextron II and Type F is used. Do you know offhand which type goes in this machine? And what about the power steering, does it have a separate automotive type pump or does it run off the main hydraulic system?

Lastly this machine is missing its exhaust after the turbo outlet. The hood is hinged and swings up for engine access. How is the original exhaust supposed to maintain a seal between the underhood exhaust piping and the upper pipe mounted to the hood? I need to fabricate a redneck equivalent and would like to know how the original was configured so I can stick as close to that design as possible.

Oh and this perkins motor starts easily, has plenty of power and purrs like a kitten. I've always heard they were good engines, so far I'm very impressed with this machine overall. I almost can't believe my good fortune finding it.

Thanks again, hope I'm not bothering you with too many questions, I'm working on getting a manual.

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ajk

02-07-2006 23:34:36




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to seann, 02-07-2006 20:05:11  
The forward/reverse clutch packs are engaged by oil pressure when you move the lever, when you press on the pedal you open a valve and the oil escapes so the clutch will disengage, the two reservoirs are for the brakes, you have a brake for each side for tight turns etc, the clutch pedal is mechanically linked, the oil used here would be the same as the US, SAE grades, the dextron would be fine. The power steering is fed from the main hydraulic reservoir, some machines had a small pump on the engine and some were fed from a section of the main pump look around the engine near the front I think it was on the right below the alternator. The exhaust stack as I remember just slipped down over silencer elbow, the drawing I have posted is of a 1999 machine and its not the same as yours, but it will give you an idea, I seem to think all the machines here had a silencer fitted, maybe noise regulations here are different.
AJ

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ajk

02-07-2006 23:40:06




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to ajk, 02-07-2006 23:34:36  
That link again



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seann

02-08-2006 13:58:35




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to ajk, 02-07-2006 23:40:06  
Thanks again for the help ajk. Ok I think I have the basics sorted out, now I just need to get a manual to learn more. Also the exhaust shown in the link is completely different from what I believe mine had. It's hard to explain without showing pictures, but basically it must have had a two part exhaust system where the upper pipe was connected to the hood and swung up with it when it is opened. The lower pipe (and muffler?) were hardmounted under the hood and the two must have had some kind of detachable mating/sealing system. Seems odd, but that's the only way it could have worked without having to unbolt the upper pipe everytime you needed to open the hood. Oh well, sooner or later I'll get it sorted out, I've got a basic design drawn up now, just need to get it fabricated.

Thanks again, you're a tremendous help!

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GN

02-09-2006 09:31:52




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to seann, 02-08-2006 13:58:35  
Hello,

I own a JCB 1400B and have the 1400B manual on cd, I am told the manual will also work for the 1550B.

If you would like a copy please email me at luvmud@yahoo.com



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seann

02-09-2006 16:02:50




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 Re: JCB Backhoe questions... in reply to GN, 02-09-2006 09:31:52  
Thanks for the offer on the manual GN, I'm looking into a 1550B manual now but I might still take you up on it. How do you like your 1400B by the way?

I experimented today a little more with the machine and I can see now that it does have a torque converter. If you have it in low gear at idle and release the clutch, it wants to go forward (or reverse depending on where the shuttle lever is put), but it can be stopped by hitting the brakes. Then if you give it some gas, it will overcome the brakes and start moving. If it only had a clutch (that slips) it wouldn't do that, so it seems clear that it's a torque converter machine. It may also mean the idle is set a bit high and that's why it wants to move at idle.

Otherwise I ran it through all its gears and it pulls strong in all of them, seems to run great. A lot bouncier and much more top heavy than my crawler, but that's to be expected. The whole machine is incredibly heavily built. It almost seems like some kind of armored vehicle. Big slabs of one and even two inch thick plating throughout the hoe frame, heavy forged members and thick welded steel plate frame with integrated hydraulic tank. And the hydraulics seem massively powerful, I was playing around with the hoe and it easily picks the whole machine up and flings it around with just a twitch of the wrist if you don't watch what you're doing. Overall I'm very impressed, it would be interesting to take a look at some of the Ford's, Case and JD's to see how they're put together in comparison. I'm sure they're all comparable, but this thing is a tank, hard to imagine anyone building a sturdier/heavier unit. Although I've heard the old Dynahoes are serious heavy metal too, almost absurdly overbuilt.

Thanks again to everyone for the help, looking forward to getting to know this machine.

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