D3B won't start without ether

sbexplor · Apr 28, 2016

I just purchased a ~1986 D3B, 27Y, 5100 hours. Everything is working well except for starting. On cranking it puts out white smoke but does not fire. A short spray of ether in the air intake and it takes off. The factory starting assist ether system has been disconnected.

When running there is no smoke. Has blow-by but seems normal from what I have read. This is the first older dozer I have had and normally work with newer excavators.

I am planning to have a compression test done. Thanks.

Case450 · Apr 28, 2016

are the batteries fully charged and connections good??? My old loader used to do that but when i installed a properly sized battery it fired right away. Just an idea.
hope things work out for ya

dpendzic · Apr 28, 2016

my d3b had the same problem and i found 2 causes--both related to transfer pump output pressure---the first was a clogged screen in the banjo fitting where the fuel line goes into the transfer pump
the second was a bad check valve in the transfer pump--these are cheap little plastic check valves--there are 3 of them and it only takes one to mess up the output pressure--i actually added a pressure gage on the output line of the transfer pump where it goes into the fuel filter--if you haven't already change the fuel filter also

Nordic · Apr 29, 2016

The D3B should start without ether down to 32 F. If you have little to no smoke when running and warm you don't have much to worry about. Undoubtedly the compression is down. If you get plenty of white smoke at good cranking speed there is no shortage fuel being supplied. If you put a quart of gear oil or transmission fluid in your fuel tank you will get easier cold starts and a bit more power too.

sbexplor · Apr 29, 2016

Thanks. I will service the battery, it is an 8DHD AC Delco with 1155 CCA.

Thanks for the other suggestions also. I am awaiting an operators and service manual and will get to it.

For interest a picture is attached. Someone painted it nicely and replaced the undercarraige.

(quoted from post at 19:46:57 04/28/16) are the batteries fully charged and connections good??? My old loader used to do that but when i installed a properly sized battery it fired right away. Just an idea.
hope things work out for ya

MSM · May 2, 2016

Could have the upper rings broken from ether use. Won't show much blowby,but the compression is lowered enough to be a hard starter.

sbexplor · May 2, 2016

Thank you. I imagine ether was used on it for awhile. There is some noticeable blow by in the sunlight.

Nordic · May 2, 2016

(quoted from post at 15:56:46 05/02/16)
There is some noticeable blow by in the sunlight.

I've had several bucket style of these machines - Cat 931. The early models had terrible blow-by. I used to plumb the blow-by smoke into the intake because breathing it for a day would make me feel so sick. Those fumes are very unhealthy to breathe. A friend of mine has a leaky muffler on his and he got a bad case of DEE (diesel exhaust exposure), something you don't want either. He got really sick and out of commission and didn't know at first what was going on. Sorry...I'm off topic I guess.

dpendzic · May 4, 2016

let us know what you find out!!

sbexplor · May 4, 2016

So far, the battery is fine. At 45-50 deg F (8-10 deg C) it will start without ether 4 hours after an initial start, after 5 hours it won't. A second fuel filter was added in the past, the reason is unknown.

I am waiting for manuals and then will look at the transfer pump and screens.

Good safety health point about the blowby, the fan is blowing out. Thanks.

Nordic · May 4, 2016

(quoted from post at 07:40:46 05/04/16)
So far, the battery is fine. At 45-50 deg F (8-10 deg C) it will start without ether 4 hours after an initial start, after 5 hours it won't.

From the facts you have given this is simply drop in compression. If it was my machine I wouldn't spend any more money on trouble shooting. Happy dozing!!

dpendzic · May 4, 2016

was the second fuel filter between the fuel tank and the transfer pump? I know of a few guys that have done that to keep debris out of the transfer pump

sbexplor · May 6, 2016

yes it's between the tank and the transfer pump

D3B won't start without ether

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