Roosa Master DB injection pump

tasthree

New User
Hello members. Newbie here with an issue. I have a Roosa Master DB injection pump on a 1982 Case 580C backhoe with a 4 cylinder diesel engine. The previous owner supposedly had the ip rebuilt at least 11 years ago. After hen pecking at it with my current skills, I have come to the conclusion that I need assistance. So I'm hoping the wisdom and expertise of the members here can help me resolve my issue. The issue is that the backhoe will not start due to no fuel getting to the injectors. It has run fine for about ten years. I ran it a couple months ago and then parked it. I went to move it recently and it wouldn't start. First thing was to crack open number 1 injector line and got no fuel when cranking. The following are things I checked or did after that. tank is nearly full and petcock is open which gravity feeds two fuel filters. Both filters are fairly new with less than about 50 hours on them. I opened both filter bleeder valves and got fuel free flowing out. Cracked open ip inlet line and outlet port which has fuel flow. removed ip inlet strainer which was clean. removed all the return fuel lines and the check valve which were clear. blew them out for good measure. removed the ip top cover and found a thin coating of medium brown color slim coating everything. checked all linkages including metering valve which all move freely. I did not notice any black substance in the bowl or in the return line or check valve to indicate debris from the internal governor weight retaining ring. I don't know if it was replaced with upgrade during its supposed rebuild years earlier. I've removed the timing cover window and checked the governor drive coupling for movement. Confirmed rotational movement so NO sheared shaft. I flushed out the upper bowl through open timing window with a spray can of lube oil. I buttoned everything back up and tried again. No fuel to cracked open fuel line at injector. Disconnected return fuel line at top cover and tried again with still no fuel. Cracked open injector line at pump and still no fuel. Then I removed the top cover and filled with a Kreen and Kroil mixture. I also filled the pump fuel inlet port with Kroil. I let this sit for a couple days. Tried again and still no fuel out. Then I cut the valve section from a bicycle inner tube and hose clamped it to the top fill opening on the fuel tank. Put some air pressure to it and tried again. Still no fuel. Everytime I'm cranking it, I have the throttle forward and giving it about an 8 to 10 second starter burst. I may wait from a few to 30 minutes between tries as to not overheat the starter. I have a new battery and am topping it off in between tries with a charger. I've also been giving it some light love taps with a small hammer in various places on the pump. For curiousity, I tried a couple of short bursts of starting fluid. I got a response from the engine and some smoke out the stack. I determined it was useless doing so without no fuel from the pump and quit the starting fluid. I've been wrenching for about 40 years and have found that research equals prudence. So i've been searching the net about my issue and thus some of the steps listed above. I've also downloaded and printed the DB section from the John Deere SM 2045 manual to help me understand things. In the past I really had no reserve in tearing into anything to fix things. I've worked as a welder and machinist amongst other things. I consider myself a jack of all trades but master of none. But, not complaining but just explaining, for years now I have had health problems and most recently battling Chron's disease. I'm trying to recover from a recent flare up so between that and the meds, my physical and mental capacities are greatly effected. In my current condition, I'm not too confident in removing the pump to tear it down, to clean and install a seal kit. Plus the fact that I am so overwhelmed with too many other things that are more important that require my limited abilities. Finances are also not conducive to paying someone to come out and trouble shoot and or fix this issue. So my question to you all is what could be stuck in the pump to block any fuel flow out of it? Pump plungers? What else could I do with the pump still mounted on the backhoe to clear it? The last time I used it I wasn't thinking due to my condition and parked it in front of a trailer that I need access to. So for now, I would like to at least get it running good enough so I can park the backhoe in its normal place. May I please ask for any replys to be simple to understand and photos or diagrams help me immensly. I thank you ahead of time for your kindness and considerations in helping me with my injection pump issue.
 
Most likely the plungers are stuck after setting with rusty fuel. Most I repair that have set awhile need a complete teardown and cleaning to get everything freed up to work again. Just did an Oliver forklift pump, had so much rust buildup the weights would not even fall out of the cage..
 
What Dieseltech said happened to my pump. Just the slightest bit of surface rust on the plungers. I had to tear the pump down and polish the plungers with a piece of note paper in diesel. I put a seal kit in and it runs like a champ now. PK
 
I think the most likely thing to have happened is you left the stop cable pulled out when you shut it down and now the metering valve is stuck in the stop position,take the top cover off the pump and operate the controls so you can see how they work,put the metering valve in the run position.put the cover back and try again.with all manual stop controls it is best to push them back in when the engine is stopped and put the throttle on full.
AJ
30645.jpg
 
AJ,
Is this meter valve in any way related to the rail system on other makes of injector pumps. Had a 242 Ford diesel in a Tree Farmer that would not accelerate as it should. Had to
clean the rail and it worked great after that. Just curious!
Mr. T. Minnesota
 
They both do similar job control amount of fuel.the rotary pump has one pumping element whereby the in-line has one for each cylinder connected together to what is commonly called the rack,I think the 242 Ford had a Simms in-line,the early models of that pump had their own independent oil,there was a filler plug on top of the governor housing with a level plug on the side,took the same oil as the engine and would be changed at the same time,if your's is later if it fed from the engine oil it will have two oil lines connected to the engine block.
AJ
 
Thanks to all replys. Dieseltech and Kelly MT. Not what I really wanted to hear at this point. I'm so far behind right now that I have trees where I don't want weeds growing on the property. Is there any possibility if I let it soak with my mixture in the top bowl that it might break loose enough to run just to move it. AJ thanks for the thought and photo. Learned the hard way and did that a few years ago. I did mention the metering valve and linkages but, didn't list everything thing I did cause I felt I was already long winded. I did remove the shut off cable to check movement of the metering valve and other linkages. Unless the top part of the metering valve will move and the portion inside won't it should be free from what I can tell. Another reason I'm posting this is to help others in my situation. It took me hours upon hours sifting thru forums just to get a tidbit here and there. I felt it would help to have a thread with the info compiled into one thread on what to look for or try.
 
Just wanted to update what happened. I let it sit for a few weeks while I took care of other priorities. I tried it every so often to see if fuel would get to the injectors. Never happened so I removed the IP from the backhoe. I dissasembled the IP,cleaned it,installed new gov ring and new pilot bushing,etc. Reinstalled IP and it started up after a couple of attemps. Runs like it always has. Iused a 16320 rebuild kit and a 24371 bushing. I ordered a s-291-6 l bristol wrench from Max Gain Systems. I cut it off some and stuck it in a 7mm socket so I could use a ratchet for removal and to torque it. The rear fastener was hard to access to remove the IP from the backhoe.A Craftsman starter&manifold wrench #4376 worked using it from below to get it off.
 

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