Torch it!!

Forum Members,
Recently posted a question about the HD3 Allis track tightening assembly. Pinball suggested heating the yoke with a torch. I found a reasonably priced propane torch on Harbor Freight and purchased it. Question is, do you think 500,000 BTU will heat the threaded yoke enough to loosen the mechanism? The torch has a high output trigger which will hopefully do the trick. Pinball also suggested candle wax in conjunction with the torch. I will try this. As far as a (beer), I mean thread chaser why not muriatic acid as a rust cleaner. May have trouble finding a 1.5 inch chaser. Any and all thoughts welcome.
Mr. T. Minnesota

Acid has a few issues. Any traces being left causing worse rust later is a big one. Citric or phosphoric are more commonly used for the purpose and a bit less prone to that issue than muriatic. Any acid will keep eating steel when the rust is gone.

If you can get the assembly in a tub, washing soda (sodium carbonate) dissolved in water and DC electricity do wonders (electrolytic de-rusting.) Just be sure to rinse that off well and then bake the part for a while to both get the water out and also to help release any hydrogen (possible issues with hydrogen embrittlement are one of the minor hazards of that method, per a metallurgist old tool restorer.) The good part is it only attacks rust, and really can't be overdone.

Negative terminal to the item to be cleaned, positive to a sacrificial iron or somewhat less sacrificial stainless electrode, - outside or well ventilated area due to hydrogen being generated.

i have loosened numerous track adjusting nuts on my dozers by repeated heat/cooling with plenty of loose juice--i prefer kroil oil/ PB blaster

Mechanical track adjuster ? Repeated cycles of heating and cooling should eventually break the bond. The threads being larger, I would think would have a decent chance of wicking in some kind of penetrant, but I think the heating and cooling, and if possible, some impact to the assembly, (obviously done with care to not damage the components). I'm picturing one from another manufacture, so maybe these are different, but as I recall a large wrench, heat, and some force applied both ways alternatively, may break the bond. Once that occurs, you may want to work it both ways, use plenty of penetrant or suitable lubrication. I used anti-seize on a heated stuck assembly, but let it cool just a bit, it looked like it wicked right in, and if I recall I could see it. Most of these penetrants appear to be snake oil, as you don't see any of it on the interior of the assembly once apart. Another brand called Free-All, by Gasoila, is a decent penetrating oil, you don't see it on the shelf in a lot of places, but I've had decent luck with it. One thing that comes to mind, how hot in Degrees F will that propane torch heat to? They're usually cooler, you don't want that assembly glowing orange either, but you will need it hot enough to work. I've used a plumber/pipe fitters acetylene B tank on small assemblies, that I did not want to get too hot, small area to work in, and sometimes I needed the oxygen acetylene to make things hotter, and most times that did the job. Persistence usually pays off, so repetition with the propane may eventually do it. At least these are up a little higher on the track frame, the roller bolts on some of these, those do not look like any fun at all to remove.

Have you had success using electrolysis on rusted fastener type assemblies?
(I've used electrolysis for happily derusting hundreds of parts. However, for loosening parts that were rusted solid, electrolysis did not work for me.)

B,
What is the anti seize you are referring to?Are they Kroil oil or PB? Will try the suggested procedures as they seem fit. The high output torch is rated at 500,000 BTU and will produce 3000 to 3600 degrees F. Tried the torch in my shop and the blue flame was about a foot long and 1.5 to 2 inches in diameter when the override trigger was actuated. Will use care in the heating and torquing process. Again, any and all thoughts are welcome.
Mr. T. Minnesota

anti seize is usually an aluminum based material and is not a penetrating oil--it is sold in most auto parts store and is applied after the parts are apart or able to get into the threads--used extensively on under carriage bolts and threads--helps tremendously to take apart in the future.

That ought to do it, that's pretty darned hot for steel or most kinds of metal, I'm no expert on metallurgy, you just don't want to over do it.

Like dpendzic said, its a compound used on all kinds of assemblies to prevent a rust bond, making it a lot easier when it needs to be disassembled.

It may have other names, I have heard it called Never or Nevr Seize, and have heard that some may contain nickel, purpose is the same. I used on anything I will or potentially have to take apart.

I think when I used it after heating the bolts that hold my tractor rim to the center, the old ones were rusted mostly away, but the threads were intact, it did wick in, and I forget who told me to use it on something like this, I was surprised. Every situation is obviously different, your results will vary, but I certainly learned something new about a product I've used since I was in my early 20's.
Permatex Anti Seize

B,
Thanks for the info. Just a heads up on using the high output torch. A friend said to use the main valve on the 20# tank as a control valve. In other words, do not let it go full blast all the time! There is no mention of this in the enclosed torch pamphlet. Hope this helps someone in the future.
Mr. T. Minnesota

It has already as I know nothing of LPG used for these kinds of things, or cutting steel etc! LOL ! Post back about how it goes, I'm sure the adjusters on my ole D7 are likely in the same shape, and I don't believe they have ever been let out since it came from the factory, they do have their covers on.

In general electrolysis is somewhat dubious for assembled fasteners since it's mostly line of sight, but I have freed up a solidly rusted pair of pliers (found at the side of the road) and had it free up the joint despite that. In some cases changing the connection point around may help a bit. This post seemed to be contemplating cleaning threads once apart.

For a penetrant, ATF or ATF + solvent.

B,
In your last post you mentioned something about "wicked in". What did you mean? Did you mean the anti seize used on the outer threads may wick into the threads or did I miss the boat on your explanation. Any and all thoughts are welcome.
Mr. T. Minnesota

s Billy said the anti seize will wick into the threads from the outside threads upon heating and cooling---some guys swear by using candle wax to wick in and free rusted threads.

Mr. T, thread restoring file is readily available and cheaper than chasing die-once you get the adjuster apart! Good luck.
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(quoted from post at 16:47:55 12/18/14) B,
What is the anti seize you are referring to?Are they Kroil oil or PB? Will try the suggested procedures as they seem fit. The high output torch is rated at 500,000 BTU and will produce 3000 to 3600 degrees F. Tried the torch in my shop and the blue flame was about a foot long and 1.5 to 2 inches in diameter when the override trigger was actuated. Will use care in the heating and torquing process. Again, any and all thoughts are welcome.
Mr. T. Minnesota

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Sounds like you bought yourself a weed burner, especially since you're talking about a 20lbs tank further down. That should do it. Get the nut hot, try not to get the rod any hotter than you have to. You can put wet rags on the rod. The hot nut should expand more than the cooler rod and break the rusts hold...eventually. At least that's the theory. Smacking things around a bit with a brass hammer while it's warm won't hurt it. And do like someone else said, work it in both directions. I'd bet 25% of the time I get stuff to loosen up by TIGHTENING the item first. Once she budges just keep working things back and forth and flood the area with go juice. Drain oil will work fine if you run out of expensive snake oil. If rust and caked on grease and mud are the issue and wire wheel does wonders before you start chasing threads.

No,500,000 btu heater will not produce enough heat to help your situation at all,presumming you are referring to the weed burners.You will need the oxy/
act.with the "poker tip",been there many times,as for an anti-seize try graphite flakes mixed with oil,
to consistince of thin gravy,for a penentrate,use
acetone half-half automatic transmission oil.

I have a pair in my tool box, they do come in handy at times !

Soaked in may work better describe this LOL !