350c reverser problem

Dan Dewar

New User
Hi Im looking for help with a JD350C. The reverser will work fine for awhile but then just stop when put in reverse. It will go forward ok and if you put it in forward on the shuttle shift you can use the clutch to put it in reverse on the transmission and it doesent seem to slip. But if your slow on the shift it will grind the gears so the clutch must not be compleatly disengageing.
 
Some of your description has me confused. Does your machine have two reverses? I.e. one in the reverser and one in the transmission? I ask because reverse was left out of the gear transmission in all the 350Cs we sold. Maybe a few early ones still had it? With the 350, and 350B series - the hydraulic reverser was only an option. When the 350C came out - it had to have the reverser to power the new hydraulic steering clutches so Deere omitted the reverse gear in the gear trans.

If you are saying that reverse in the reverser slips - I suggest you stick a 200 PSI gauge in the clutch port and check PSI in forward and reverse. See if you are getting the necessary 120 PSI (or higher) in forward and in reverse.
 
I dont think it slips, more like it doesent engage at all. I was bringing to the yard yesterday to wash and put in the shop when it started leaking hyd oil, pulled off the stump pan and it looks like its comeing from front seal on reverser from around the shaft that goes into the fly wheel. I wont be sure until I get the motor out, but have changed this seal before. Im thinking I may have to fix seal then put motor back in to do tests because Im afraid I wont get a accurate pressure reading as the pump will be leaking. Im wondering if I should pull the reverser and do the clutch packs while the motor is out or just replace seal then do tests. Like I said in first poast when it works it dont seem to slip at all and when it stops it dont work at all in reverse. I need to get it cleaned up and get a better look at the linkage I guess.Could hyd problems cause the seal to fail or is it more likely a problem with a bearing inside reverser? It was only about a year ago that I last changed this seal.
 
Sorry I dident see your full response before I replyed. Yes it has the shuttle shift for reverse and a reverse gear on the transmission.
 
There is one other thing that might cause the reverser to act up is a cast lever inside the reverser control valve.. If memory serves , this lever operates the clutch valve spool.. the lever is an open fork style lever and one side wears where the clutch valve spool pushes against it.. You can remove the control valve from the reverser housing while still in the machine.. Although , it's no fun.. Studs have to be removed to clear the engine frame rail..
 
First off thanks for your advice, I just started and moved it to wash and the reverser worked fine. Do you think its worth pulling motor, fixing seal, and putting motor back in then look farther at reverser problem? Or should I take out reverser and check it better while motor is out. I don't mind risking having to pull motor again if it saves me some money on parts I don't really need to change.
 
You pull the motor you're apt to find many things that need repair. Especially the torsional isolator parts on the flywheel. Also - if the reverser-pump seal is leaking at the input shaft- it's likely the shaft is loose and the reverser must come out to fix that problem.

About the forward-reverse shift-fork as mentioned by the other poster. True it can wear but if so, will show up in the clutch pressure test I suggested you do.

Another possible problem is the clutch pedal linkage not returning all the way. Common issue when the spring gets worn out and dirt gets in there.
 
I got it cleaned up and in the shop, going to pull motor this A.M. Reverser worked good for awhile then stoped again. The leak is quite bad so seal is first problem on list. If the shaft is loose what needs to be done? Spring on clutch is good and pettle returns well. Is the fork that weares out under a housing?
 
The front input shaft where the seal is leaking has to be set at around .002" endplay. When it gets excessively loose, it is usually because the center-bearing inside the reverser is worn out. No way to fix without removing the reverser and taking it all apart. It's the small Timken style cup and cone bearing that rides between the input shaft and output shaft. It only turn
In regard to shifter fork? If you look at the linkage that hooks to the reverser for "forward" and "reverser" the shaft going into the control housing is what attaches, internally, to that fork.
 
I got the motor out, the srings on fly wheel look good pilot bearings ok, seal looks ok to, shaft has abit of side play but I cant feel any end play, but was really leaking from somewhere. I found a couple of pieces of steel in bell housing, they look like they were a small ring with a recess cut into the inside. Any idea where that could have come from? The pump looks ok to and im sure the pieces would have done a lot of damage if the went thru the pump.
 
Sounds like the starter-drive stop. It's a three piece setup. It's a problem spot in those 25MT Delco direct-drive starters. It consists of a round ring maybe 1/2" or 5/8" diameter with a recess for a snap-ring to squeeze into. Parts #s 11,12, and 13 in the image.

As far as the front shaft goes - it will always feel loose even when right. Needs the pilot bearing in the crank/flywheel for full support. Measuring end-play is the only way to check.
a172431.jpg
 
Looks like I have a starter to fix to. I think the seal was leaking due to my not seating it far enough in to the cover last time I changed it, or it pushed out, it was flush with cover. Should it be in all the way? Looks like room for 2. I do have good repair and parts books but it really helps to be able to ask someone who knows them, thanks.
 
I have a late 350c from 1985 that has the reverse in the trans and the reverser. Must be an option in some of these.
 
You were rite on about the starter, got that fixed and put a gauge on the port just above where the reverser linkage hooks up to the housing. It says 170 psi tried another gauge and get the same pressure. Have another gauge on other port farther ahead on same houseing and it reads just over 20 psi. This is with motor at slow idle, 750 rpm according to tack. Is this to much? If so what might be the problem?
 
170 PSI clutch port is fine. So is the 20 PSI lube/release pressure. The reverser clutches will work at 120 PSI but the pressure had to be raised when the C series came out to keep the new wet steering clutches from slipping. Are you sure you've got 170 PSI in reverse when slipping? If so, are you sure it's not your steering clutches slipping and NOT your reverser?
 
Its a long story but I found some home made parts in the reliefes, The oil cooler was at 110 psi, I now have it set at 90, the clutch port is at 120 and the other one is just over 20. It seems to be working but haven't taken it out of shop to try out yet. Its a 1978 JD350C, what should the pressures be. Also noticed that when I put shuttle shift in forward with trans in neutral the motor works harder than when I put it in reverse. Pressure is the same in either position. This is all at slow idle about 750 rpm.
 
Clutch pressure needs to be higher then 120 PSI
in a "C" model. That pressure is fine for a
350, or 350B with dry steering clutches. A "C"
needs 150 PSI to the steering clutches won't
slip and they get their power from the
reverser.

If the reverser works harder in forward then in
reverse - there something wrong. Odd though.
Usually it's reverse that works harder when the
input shaft if turning a different direction
then the output shaft. It sounds like your
reverse clutch pack is warped and dragging. It
has to spin free when the forward pack is
engaged. When you put it into reverse - the
reverse clutch pack has to lock up so then you
WANT drag. Lots of it. Slipping clutches get
hot and warp. Sounds like you'll be rebuilding
the reverser soon. Or stop using hydraulic
reverse and hope for the best. You're lucky
to have a gear reverse in the transmission.
Most Cs did not have it.
 
(quoted from post at 15:17:45 11/01/14) Clutch pressure needs to be higher then 120 PSI
in a "C" model. That pressure is fine for a
350, or 350B with dry steering clutches. A "C"
needs 150 PSI to the steering clutches won't
slip and they get their power from the
reverser.

If the reverser works harder in forward then in
reverse - there something wrong. Odd though.
Usually it's reverse that works harder when the
input shaft if turning a different direction
then the output shaft. It sounds like your
reverse clutch pack is warped and dragging. It
has to spin free when the forward pack is
engaged. When you put it into reverse - the
reverse clutch pack has to lock up so then you
WANT drag. Lots of it. Slipping clutches get
hot and warp. Sounds like you'll be rebuilding
the reverser soon. Or stop using hydraulic
reverse and hope for the best. You're lucky
to have a gear reverse in the transmission.
Most Cs did not have it.
The local dealer says its about 8000 dollars for the kits to rebuild the reverser. Does this sound rite or did we get a part number wrong somewhere. He says John Deere no longer suplies them and he has to order from a antique parts. place.
 

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