Dozer or Crawler Loader. A new Approach.

Stathamj

Member
Trying to find out what some of the more experianced operators think. I found an older D4c that the undercarriage was in good shape. But,it did have worn blade pins and holes(Where the blade attaches to the blade frame and dozer frame) and grouser pads(30%). This dozer weighs around 11k lbs. But, probably more, as it has Orops and sweeps. So, maybe 12.5K. I have also found several track loaders in the same price range and wonder if they might be better overall for me. There is a Case 455c and 855D. There was a JD555G and lastly a Komatsu D53s. All of these were in the $13K price range like the dozer. There was also a Cat 931 that was an old farm dozer. Owner said it had an undercarriage of 30-40% for $9,500. I know that weight and power are your friends.
I recently purchased an old neglected timber tract and need something to get it into shape again. I don't have time to go the rental route and it's taken 6 months to get someone to come out and look at doing the work and he's 2 months behind. But, he's expensive I thought. But, I'm still having him do it because I needed it done by Labor day and that has come and gone. That's why I'm getting somethingto do it myself.
Basically I'll be using it for fence-lines, cleaning up underbrush, pushing up the underbrush and hauling it to the burn pile. There's also some brush pile that someone before me that need moved and burnt. I will occasionally push and clear out some smaller sapplings and larger dead trees. In one area I thought about a small pond 1/2 acre or so.

So, do you think in your opinions I'd be better off with the small dozer or do you think that the loader whichever one I decide to get would work? Any opinions on the loaders. I will appriciate your responses. I was originally going to get the dozer when I thought it weighed 16K lbs (newer one)vs the 11-12K (older one).

Thanks for your time,

James
 
Personally I find the track loaders very versatile for the work you're describing. You need good long teeth on the bucket (4 in 1 bucket is excellent) for dealing with brush and general clearing chores. Unless the dozer comes with some kind of a brush clearing attachment a straight blade machine has difficulty separating brush from dirt and sods. Currently I have two Cat 931 wide pad machines and they are excellent for soft ground conditions. I've had a Cat 955K and several Cat 941's .... great for power but all with narrow tracks which is good except for the wet season. It will pay off for you to find a bulldozer that has a good under carriage as that is generally your biggest maintenance cost when time comes for upgrade.
 
I'm not what you'd call an experienced operator but I've been around construction and machinery a lot.
If I was in the market for a machine to do the type of work you described I'd be looking for a crawler loader with a 4 in 1 bucket.

Condition of the undercarriage is crucial. If you don't know how to measure it take someone along who does when you go to look at these machines.
After the undercarriage my next criteria would be parts support.

If they're all in similar condition I'd lean towards the 855D.
 
All I can tell you that undercarriage condition is everything. That's your #1 concern with anything on tracks.
 
Each has advantages, crawler loader, you can dig, carry, load, haul things around, but if the distances are long, you'd be better off with a wheel loader. Dozer is nice for grading, fixing roads and such, liklely more flotation in soft ground. One difference between the 2 is that, well on older caterpillar tractors is that the track frames would oscillate on a dozer, and not on a crawler loader, meaning the dozers track frames will contour to rough terrain, vs being rigid, making a crawler more stable for loading trucks etc. Something to know.

I like both, I've spent a lot of time on 977L's and 955's and have cleared, loaded trucks even had forks on the 977 and distributed ductile iron water main on easements for the pipe crew, keeping ahead of them. 4 in on bucket is nice, but there were times I just needed a dozer with at least tilt. Pads on the crawler loader will likely not be aggressive, you can put dozer track pads on, and I've seen tractors with them, but most are double or triple bar, not very tall, and will slip more in places where a dozer with good pads won't. Crawler loaders while still a useful tractor, have gone the wayside due to hydraulic excavators being much more versatile, but I'd still take one if reasonable, you'll really want to pinpoint the work you want to do before deciding.

Do make sure to measure up an undercarriage, like said in the previous post, eyeballing is not a good idea.
 
when i bought my land in NW Mass i bought a track loader with a 4 in 1 bucket. The bucket teeth are great for pushing brush,rooting out small saplings, and rolling a brush pile over. I pick up stumps with the 4 in 1 and load on a dump truck. If i need to bulldoze I raise the jaws and push dirt with the blade. The biggest drawback on pushing dirt is that you have no tilt. So I eventually bought a dozer with a 6 way blade.
I did weld on some grouser bar on the loader to get more traction
 
Knowing just what you've told me, and as a heavy equipment mechanic by trade who has alot of customers with older equipment, it sounds to me like your best option in the mix of machines you mentioned is the JD555. Beyond that all of the other advice given to this point is right on point.
 
Well, I called around 9:00 this morning and the Case 455c ant the Cat 931 (that was an old farm dozer). Was the only ones left. They were sold and headed to Mexico. So, I"m still looking. I"m thinking a D4D or D6B or D6C. Loader still a 931, 939. I just think I want to stay away from the Hydrostat models. Any thought, ideas, suggestions?

James
 
Well, right now I haven't come up with anything better than the D4C I originally looked at. I will keep looking though. But, I was thinking if I got the D4 then I could do the undergrowth clean-up and leave the larger stuff to the other guy. When I looked at the work to be done I figured (my estimate) that it would take about 8-10 hours. Based on what I've had others do for me. I figured $1000.00 - $1200.00. The owner/operators estimate was 2 days and $3000.00. using a D5 Cat. So, basically it came out 2-3 times what I thought it should. That's $150.00 an hour for a 10 hour day. I thought that was a little high. I know, if you buy one and have to repair it you might appriciate the $3000 for two days. But, buying my own, I could do it when I could as needed. Then leave him the big stuff for later. My analogy may be flawed. But, even if I spent $6000.00 on repairing it that would only be 4 days work and I'd still have it the rest of the year to use whenever I needed it.
Any thoughts,comments or ideas?

James
 
I have taken down many a large tree with my D3B with 6 way blade. You can circle the tree with the blade ripping out all the roots and then easy to push over--even had one 16 inch tree blow over from the wind while cutting the roots (thank God in the right direction)
 
I have a 1969 Cat. 941 Traxcavator. Direct elec. start, power shift with GP bucket with 8 teeth. 3250 hrs. One owner. Starts and runs good. Also converted a dozer blade to fit the tractor. 8' wide. All for $6500.00 Located in panhandle of Nebraska on I-80. Have pictures.
 
(quoted from post at 21:53:32 09/20/13)

So, do you think in your opinions I'd be better off with the small dozer or do you think that the loader whichever one I decide to get would work? Any opinions on the loaders. I will appriciate your responses. I was originally going to get the dozer when I thought it weighed 16K lbs (newer one)vs the 11-12K (older one).

Thanks for your time,

James

James, pay attention to Blain Plunkett's offer here.

I sold my same vintage 933 but a lot more hours for more and the buyer shipped it to Peru. Tough old tractors that'll get the job done.

My choice was to go to rubbertire, now running a 944 with 4 in 1 which will do everything I ask. I'm not surprised at the quotes you've gotten.

One estimate I gave for $4400 but recommended the guy call someone with a larger crawler. He told me my recommendation had already been there and wanted $20k for the same job. I about fell over. Working by the hour, I completed the driveway for $3300. He gave me a $1000 bonus.

Then had the major job of creating his house site. Which is my business plan: buy a tractor and then let a client pay for it. My 944 is far from worn out, and owes me nothing. Here, large rubbertire loaders are much cheaper than crawlers.

This is what a smaller 933 easily handled. Plenty of power. But like everybody said, know your undercarriage before purchase. Second photo was a rock that was too large for my 933, required the 944 hydraulics to budge it.
mvphoto20987.jpg

mvphoto20988.jpg
 
James. Could you call me or e mail me your address so I can send picture? Can't get pictures to load on here for some reason. 308-289-5881
 
I had a 977 Cat with 4 way bucket, log forks and logging winch and arch. I also had a D6. I used the 977 to dig ditch and dike, load log trucks, yard logs, even bunch and use log forks to take logs to landing. I welded on 3" grousers. Loaders are heavier than bulldozers and usually have narrower tracks. Yes I have been stuck a few times and they go down fast. They are harder on the tracks if you turn much with a bucket load. I loaded a lot of river rock to build base for roads so the 4in1 worked great+ digging ditches. As has been said a good bucket works better for pushing brush, I had a brush rake instead of using the bucket too, keeps dirt out of pile. You can push over big trees with the loader up high for leverage

I also had a D6 set up about the same, for logging, land leveling and road building. If I had 1, it would be the 977. Both had the same engine but the 977 was slower, because it was heavier. Cost more to keep going but could use for a lot more jobs. Like said not good for building roads....James
 
I had a 977 Cat with 4 way bucket, log forks and logging winch and arch. I also had a D6. I used the 977 to dig ditch and dike, load log trucks, yard logs, even bunch and use log forks to take logs to landing. I welded on 3" grousers. Loaders are heavier than bulldozers and usually have narrower tracks. Yes I have been stuck a few times and they go down fast. They are harder on the tracks if you turn much with a bucket load. I loaded a lot of river rock to build base for roads so the 4in1 worked great+ digging ditches. As has been said a good bucket works better for pushing brush, I had a brush rake instead of using the bucket too, keeps dirt out of pile. You can push over big trees with the loader up high for leverage

I also had a D6 set up about the same, for logging, land leveling and road building. If I had 1, it would be the 977. Both had the same engine but the 977 was slower, because it was heavier. Cost more to keep going but could use for a lot more jobs. Like said not good for building roads....James
Did you notice this post is 11 years old?
 

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