Beaten CASE 450 Crawler_Ya I bought it.What would you do if?

Lucky450

New User
I recently purchased a CASE 450 crawler/loader (serial# 302). This poor machine is beat to say the least. I bought it from a farmer for $1000 when he managed to get it to fire up and prove to me that it can move under it's own power. Not knowing a thing about bulldozers, but being a good mechanic, I descided to take a chance on it.

When I got it back to my garage ($250) and took a better look at it, serial numbers, etc, I realized that it was supposed to have a G188 gas engine but instread had a A201G that I believe came from a 660 CASE combine. The machine would run rough (3 cyl) but just looked like it needed some TLC.

The electrical system was a complete mess, so I rewired the entire machine (returning it to factory original, $200). I removed the carb to clean it just to find that one ear of the two bolt flange was broken off. I had the carb welded and machined (NC thanks to a buddy of mine) and put it back on.

Topped up the fluids including the engine coolant and started it up. When it ran I soon realized that the exhaust manifold on cylinder #4 was cracked and was spitting out green coolant when it was running. I shut it down and realized that coolant was somehow entering the cylinder.

I pulled the head off to find no smoking gun. The head gasket looked good and all sleeves do not show signs of any cracks (not sure if the sleeved are wet or dry on the 201). I sent the head out for magnefluxing and it came back scrack free. So what was it? A straight edge on the head looks like the head is not straight. My guess is the farmer ran it without coolant and overheated it. I know rain water got in because I removed the #4 exhause valve and it's baddly corroded around where it seats.

The question is: What would you do? Do I spend the money, reface the head and rebuild the top end of the 201 and risk it? or...

My other buddy has two old CASE IH 93 and 94 combines that are stored inside that he is willing to sell for scrap. The're both complete and haven't run in 10 years but were stored propperly. I don't know if the engines would fit in my 450 but would consider doing an engine swap if I had to. I'm $1450 into it and don't want to waist another $300 just to rebuild the top end ant find out I missed a crack somewhere else on the engine. What would you do? Thanks for all your input!
 
Have you had someone look at the undercarriage who knows about
them? They can be much more expensive than the engine. I do not
know a lot about it but I have thought about a small crawler and
done some reading over the years.
Zach
 
I can tell you that a IH combine motor will not fit in your loader. They were made before the Case IH merger so not related at that time!
 
Thanks for the replys. This means that I will have no choice but to repair the A201G gas engine that I currently have in my 450.

I looked closely at all 4 sleeves and can not see any evidence of a crack. The #1 sleeve does look rough compared to the other 3, but no signs of a crack. I left the coolant level in the block flush with the top of the block with the thought that if a crack was present, the coolant would flood the cylinder if I let it sit long enough. None of the 4 cylinders flooded. I'm still not convinced a sleeve is cracked. I am leaning more towards the idea that the head gasket face is warped. What do you guys think?

As for the undercarriage, ya it's pretty done. I bought the crawler with the thought that I would have to put money on that and not the engine.
 
Zachary Hoyt was spot on. Undercarriage can be a much bigger money pit compared to the engine. You may be lucky and it is only the motor which has been abused.

Antifreeze going past a hot valve is likely the cause of the corrosion. And the cracked manifold is also a likely pointer to 'cold' water sprayed on a very hot area.

Are the valve guides fitted through the cooling system on that head? Seems as though that could be a leak, especially when the radiator was pressurised. It should have been pushing water out of the radiator if the head gasket was leaking and possible hydraulic lock if the leak was a big one. Shame you didn't check out a bit more before pulling the engine apart.

RAB
 
Thanks Oliver90Owner. All 7 valve ports in the head are normal and dry except the exhaust port on the #4 cylinder. When it ran the rad never had time to pressurize as the coolant (so much that it couldn't all burn in the cylinder) came out the crack in the manifold and sprayed out the side.

I had the head magnefluxed but not pressure checked. They didn't find any cracks so that's why I am thinking it is the head face that is not straight.

As for the carriage, I knew it was done when I bought it and am not too worried. There are enough used dealers and farmers around to do something. If the tracks fall off, I can always bolt wheels on it and turn it into a tractor.

The engine however is driving me nuts. I'm at the point where I just want to find something to justify the coolant leak that seems to be limited to the #4 cylinder.
 
if the head was magnefluxed it will not show any cracks that do not come to the surface so if it is cracked around a valve guide it will not show up any internal cracks will not show they must come to the out side GOOD LUCK
 
First, I would drain out ALL of the antifreeze,
then put the head back on and VERY THOROUGHLY
flush the cooling system with fresh water (you
want to remove ALL traces of antifreeze). then
fill the cooling system about half way with fresh
water & then add 1 Quart of Sodium Silicate (aka:
"Water Glass"), and then fill the cooling system
up with fresh water. Start the engine and let it
idle for about 1 hour while closely watching your
temp. gauge (you don't want it to overheat). Check
your coolant level & check to see if your leak has
stopped, if the leak hasn't stopped keep idling
the engine a while longer. - I have used Sodium
Silicate to repair all kinds of cooling system
leaks: cracked heads, radiator leaks, heater coil
leaks, and cracked blocks. In FACT I sealed a
cracked block that had a crack big enough that you
could drop a kitchen match through the crack, it
didn't seal right away but it DID seal.

IMPORTANT: Do NOT under ANY circumstances put
Sodium Silicate into a cooling system that has
antifreeze in it! The Sodium Silicate will turn
the antifreeze into a thick gelatinous mass that
will completely plug up your cooling system.

Doc
 
Current scrap value is probably around what you have in the machine. It might even be slightly more depending on where you"re at. I believe that"s about a 15,000 lb machine, so call up your local scrap dealers and see what they"ll give you. You're better off paying more and starting off with a better machine.

You should learn as much as you can and also have a knowledgeable person come with you when you check out any prospective machines. Expect to pay at least $5K or more for a 450 size machine in good condition with a good U/C.

But before buying anything, analyze what your needs are and decide if you really need a crawler or if hiring out a pro is your best bet. For most people, hiring the job out is the best bet.
 

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