Case 580CK (pre-B) Won't Start, Sat 5 years

I was given a 1967 Case Backhoe last week. It has sat outside for 5 years, unstarted. It reportedly had new clutch, new tires, new pistons, new hydraulic lines about 5-6 years ago. I am not a mechanic, but can do some basic things. So I put in new battery (12V), drained the fuel using both the tank drain and the first filter drain, changed the first and 2nd filters, bled it to the 2nd filter and then to the injector, verified there is some spitting after the injector when the starter button is turned. So it seems to be getting fuel. I took the air filter assembly off, cleaned it (but not put it back on yet). When I try starter fluid at the air-cleaner-attachment-pipe, it turns over very easily (too easy?) and makes a little black smoke, but doesn't start (or chug or anything). A friend said he thought it was turning over too easily. Even a larger spray of starter fluid, nothing. (turns over fine). What would make it not start with starting fluid after sitting 5 years, and reportedly ran ok previously (but needed starting fluid to start it in the past). I did note there was no cover over the exhaust stack x5 years, and some water may have gotten in that way. Oil looks ok, no water in it. What moves should I try next to get it going? Any help is appreciated. (then, next question, if I can't get it going, can you load a backhoe on a trailer that won't start?) --Tim

Sorry, a few more details, it won't let me edit. It is a diesel, and the exhaust cover was on (flap thing) but not completely covering exhaust pipe. It has a hoe on the back and a loader on the front.

After setting five years without running I'd be surprised if the injection pump even works. Most I get in that have set more than a year won't work as the plungers and/or metering valve are stuck inside as the fuel gets stale, especially if there's any water in the fuel. If the pump is working, and the engine is weak on compression you should have LOTS of white smoke at the exhaust when cranking it over. No smoke? means no fuel is getting past the injectors.

dieseltech has it....no white smoke no fuel...btw..no starter fluid until you have lots of smoke...or you'll be broke. jmh gobble

With the comment from your friend that it sounds like it's turning over too easily you could have valves that are stuck open and if so ether won't do anything for you while trying
to start. I had this happen to a tractor I was trying to start this summer. It had sat 8 years since the last time it was running. I took the valve cover off and sprayed penetrating oil
on the valve stems and tapped and pried on the valves and springs and they all loosened up quite easily. After that the tractor started immediately. Yes you can move a dead
backhoe but you really need another backhoe to lift, push and maneuver to get it on a trailer, it's not so easy but it can be done.

I had a similar experience with a customers equipment not to long ago..
I helped him w/ his pump.. it was frozen solid from sitting a few years..
Pop tested the injectors.. they were ok..
Installed everything and got the pump to pumping.. NO START..
Luckily I had my compression tester and found about 90psi on the cylinders..
Naturally he was looking at an overhaul.. I told him to remove the injectors and squirt some transmission fluid in the holes and let it sit a week..
THEN crank the engine to get rid of the oil and reinstall the injectors..
A week later he sent me a video of the engine running.. IT WORKED..
Its worth a try.. Good luck.

ok, thanks everyone. sounds like I can try the 'add oil to cylinders thru injector holes' first (how much? do I fill them up all the way???). oil should come back out thru holes when I crank it after a few days, right, shouldn't hurt anything if cylinders were full? (I obviously would not reinstall injectors till oil was pushed out with starter thru injector holes) then reinstall injectors and turn fuel on, and crank?)

then next I guess I'd try to take the valve covers off and pry at them.

again I know the injector pump is pushing fuel because I cracked the injector line AFTER the pump, and when I push the starter it is squirting some fuel into the injectors. just nothing else happening.

I will stop trying starter fluid, don't want to be broke!

thank you all!

Update: Took cowl off engine. Cleaned top of engine. Took valve cover off, confirmed everything moving freely with cranking, nothing stuck under valve cover (was easier than I thought it would be). Bled fuel lines to each injector and confirmed fuel is getting to injectors. Bled air from return line to fuel tank. Still no starty starty starty. I see today it has a glow plug on the intake (a single one), not hooked up. Was thinking of hooking second battery to this to see if hotter air would make it start (of course no starter fluid then!)

Do you have white exhaust smoke yet? Injection pump may still have issues, it may be bringing some fuel up to the injectors, but not have the pressure/flow needed to open them to get fuel into the combustion chambers. Pumps have three main jobs, to pressurize, time, and meter the fuel.

Still no white smoke. questions for you: Can a diesel engine be flooded with fuel? can the exhaust possibly be underwater if it sat 5 years and water was able to get down the exhaust pipe? The only way it would NOT be getting fuel would be if the injectors themselves are plugged, but that wouldn't explain why it wouldn't even catch a little when I tried the ether. Something else is wrong.

Another question: some friends have suggested pulling it around to try to get it to start. I don't know how I could steer it while pulling it though since it has a pump not a solid rod going to the front wheels. how could you steer it without the engine running? will it hurt it to jack the hoe up? can't pull it with the hoe on the ground.

Sounds like it's got several problems, not just one. It should run on ether, it doesn't. You should have exhaust smoke, it doesn't. And it sounds like it cranks over much too easily. the only diesels I've seen flood with fuel are pulling engines, as they are grossly overfueled and count on the turbo to help burn the fuel under load. My MF puller has to be started by cranking the engine with the fuel stop off, then slowly turn it on while cranking. You won't have that problem on a stock engine.

You could pull an injector and turn it up side down and hook it back up to the line..
STAND CLEAR and crank the engine.. Fuel SHOULD squirt out of the end of the injector..
Just like DT was saying.. the pump might be pumping AT THE INJECTOR LINES BUT not have enough pressure to OPEN THE INJECTOR.
As far as HOW MUCH transm oil to use.. you want to cover the top of piston and rings..

Getting the right amount of oil in the cylinder will be a challenge. Adding oil through the injector holes, oil will first end up in the piston chamber cup. It will take more than you think BEFORE any will go over the piston top and find it's way to the rings. You could overfill each one, let it set awhile and then crank the engine over with the injectors out to remove the excess oil. Be ready for a big oily mess though..

(quoted from post at 14:56:21 09/01/16) Getting the right amount of oil in the cylinder will be a challenge. Adding oil through the injector holes, oil will first end up in the piston chamber cup. It will take more than you think BEFORE any will go over the piston top and find it's way to the rings. You could overfill each one, let it set awhile and then crank the engine over with the injectors out to remove the excess oil. Be ready for a big oily mess though..

Click to expand...

Well we pulled the injectors today, and they are covered with crud. The forward-most cylinder is making no compression, the other 3 pretty weak. We put oil in the cylinders to sit a few days, but don't have high hopes at this point. Nothing to lose by trying though to free up the rings. If I could at least get it to start I could drive it onto a trailer and lift the tools up rather than getting a second backhoe in to do it. Thanks everyone for the suggestions.

(quoted from post at 16:41:19 09/02/16)

(quoted from post at 14:56:21 09/01/16) Getting the right amount of oil in the cylinder will be a challenge. Adding oil through the injector holes, oil will first end up in the piston chamber cup. It will take more than you think BEFORE any will go over the piston top and find it's way to the rings. You could overfill each one, let it set awhile and then crank the engine over with the injectors out to remove the excess oil. Be ready for a big oily mess though..

Click to expand...

Well we pulled the injectors today, and they are covered with crud. The forward-most cylinder is making no compression, the other 3 pretty weak. We put oil in the cylinders to sit a few days, but don't have high hopes at this point. Nothing to lose by trying though to free up the rings. If I could at least get it to start I could drive it onto a trailer and lift the tools up rather than getting a second backhoe in to do it. Thanks everyone for the suggestions.

Click to expand...

UPDATE *** Two of the injectors were bad. One was bent, one did a stream rather than a mist. After a week of ATF and Liquid Wrench in all 4 cylinders, we put it back together today with the new injectors and...it started right up. Starts fine now without any ether. Thanks again to everyone for their suggestions to get the Beast running...it worked!