Worst Allis tractor?

What do you think is the worst Allis tractor built from about 1960 to 1985, and why? Or if you are in the camp that thinks AC never built a bad tractor, what was the "least good"?
 
I would say the early D17 and the early D19 and the XT190. All of them they tried to cut corners on and used parts like the transmission and rear end from an earlier smaller tractor and ended up with transmission that would not stay in gear and other such things but on all the latter ones they fixed the earlier problems. That is one of the reasons for the D-17 having 4 series of them and each was an improvement of the earlier one
 
I had a D14
The transmission gear shift lever when up under the seat, this model had a weak third gear, after a while it would jump out of third gear going
down hill with a load pushing,
They appeared to get worse as they aged, could be very dangerous, brakes had to be in top condition,

The D15 may have the same setup,

I moved to the flat land, the D14 problem when away as I almost never had a load pushing me down hill,
It was a good tractor just needed, independent pto to have been a great tractor,
 
I have a D19 my dad bought back in the late 60's and it doesn't jump out of gear after thousands of hours the gear jumping was mostly lousy operators that tried to
shift on the go.Its been a great tractor used it to bale some hay today.
 
NOTE I said early as in first year or so of production and even then early in the year because they found many of the problems in the first 2 or 3 months of productions and took care of them
 
Hard to say as they were built for a different segment of the tractor market than an IH or JD. They did well in small dairy country where heavy drawbar work was at a minimum. To answer your question probably the 7580 but AC had no business putting the 426 engine in such a large 4WD application.
 
Tough one: from point of lacking operator comfort the wc and wd were up there. The rc was supposed to be a failure but I liked them. Some people did not like the last series of allis made much.
 
I have to agree with NY 986, on this one,that 426 was expected to run to fast in that tractor, and in that one combine application, was it 2850 or 2950 RPM, but people will do foolish things when there desperate.
 
Not staying in gear has nothing to do with the manufactures and all to do with operator abuse.
 
From an old tractor dealer who has long since passed on. He many years ago told me about a number of the early production A/C tractors and said he would check serial numbers and if they fell below X number he would not even take one in as a trade in. One tractor he would not even take in no matter what was the XT190
 
Not what i was told by a couple of old now dead A/C dealers both said a design problem and one would not even so much as have an Xt190 on his lot that was one you could have given him and he would have said NO
 
Series I and II 190XT had lighter rear ends, and AC had a dealer warranty program on them. Locally, some dealers did not tell the farmers that they could get the factory upgrade...but the Series III had those issues addressed and were extremely good tractors. However, I still believe that most third gear issues in AC tractors were operator abuse. I remember a common expression back then when ops would grind gears, rather than come to a full stop to shift...any brand: "Grind a pound for me too". I grew up with AC, and have always had some around in 45 years of farming full-time, and never had a shifter problem.
 
Agree,I have a 190XT 1965 Model it has the original rear no problems and it doesn't jump out of any gear the fellow that had it always operated it carefully and never over weighted it.
When I see 190's with lots of extra weight,duals and the injection pump turned up then its predictable there are going to be mechanical problems.
 
This guy was told old and set in his ways to worry about doing that he just flat out said I will NEVER have an XT190 on my lot. Could have worked for the guy but never did. When I would call him for a part he knew exactly who I was. When he died his son did not want to keep his place going so it sold at auction. Sad thing was his place one one of the best ones in the area and he had started out as an Oliver dealer and then branched out to others from there
 
The 190XT cost Allis a ton of money to update the driveline and then continue to update for years after. Kinda like Farmall and the 560 and then the 1206 ??? Once the initial updates were performed, then after a couple of years of heavy moldboard plowing with 110+ HP (on a rear end designed for 94 HP) they found out the differential didn't hold together as well as it should. This would only have been on overpowered moldboard plowing tractors that seemed to be the ones with issues. If the serial number was 9001 or LOWER it was one that got the driveline update kit and I don't care if it was a 1965 or 1966. If it was a diesel it sure should have gotten it and it was only the Dealerships fault if it didn't. Third gear jump out issues were mostly due to gear-grinder Operators. Any dealer who refused to trade for one wasn't thinking very clearly. It was a tractor that would out perform any other brand in the 94 HP class and use less fuel doing it. That Dealer sounds like one who wasn't up with the times and had a damn poor Service Department and a small building with no real tooling to work with !!! A-C paid for many of the 4-pinion differential updates even when the tractor may have been 4 or 5 years old??? Maybe not 100% but they did help with costs. The point here is, A-C did pretty much make it right with the Customers. The D-19 diesel ?? that is my vote for the worst model. It was 3 years too late in history, didn't have live hydraulics and the diesel engine was doomed for failure with blocks that couldn't hold the sleeves up where they belonged and heads that cracked and blew head gaskets. There was NO FIX for this. They just tried to move you into a new One-Ninety tractor and hopefully not an early XT.
 
If your talking about the guy I said something about no he was not he just flat out hated the XT190 and had some bad problem with them so he said NEVER again. The man had owned the dealer ship since he was in his 20s and ran it up till a few week before he died at the age of 70 something from a heart attack
 
I'm not going to completely disagree with you here, but it was partially poor design. There were other tractors that you could grind into gear and have no real ill effects for most of the tractor's life. It wasn't overly reasonable of Allis to expect a guy to start out in 4th gear with a decent load behind them, nor would Allis have stood behind a dry clutch that was burnt up because of this, citing operator abuse. There was only one thing the Allis had going for them, and that was the PowerDirector. Non live PTO, dry brakes, Bull gear planetary drives, dry main clutch, dry PTO clutch, list goes on and on.
 
I think the D19. Grandfather had a new one and only kept it one year before trading it on a 190xt. The draft control would not work right. With a semi mount plow when lowered the front would bury itself before the draft control would work. Dealer was out several times and could not get it right. The XT started jumping out of gear when only one year old and it was not from gear grinding as grandfather was very particular about his equipment. It is a wonder he never had rear end problems as the dealer sold it to him with a six botttom 16 inch plow. The jumping out of gear was a design problem because some dealers learned that if you replaced the gear and changed the detent position on the shifting rails it would never have problems again. The biggest disappointment on the 190 to me is the fact that it did not have fully independent pto. It was misserable to run a forage harvester with. With a 4020 at the end of the field you could stop and change gears to go across the head lands. Not with the 190 unless you waited for the chopper to clear then shifted and throttled back and then repeated before pulling back in the row again. A real pain and time waster. I still want a 190 someday as grandfather had one. Tom
 
Before 1960 I think they were all good. After 1960 I think Allis
fell on there face and never got up again.

Never knew anyone that had a 190 or 200. Have heard they had
transmission problems. Everyone I know that had a 7000 series
had transmission trouble. I have never seen a real 8000 series.
 
Going to have to say the 5040, hydraulics are slow
at best, pto engagement does not lend itself to tasks
where you are starting and stopping the pto and the
front end was not made well enough to use with a
loader. Dad stilll has his but brother and I avoid
using it much. Our d14, wd, and 7040 are good
machines used to have a 190xt III that wasn't bad
was a good tillage horse but not handy for pto work
like running the chopper or round baler traded it for
the 7040 to get more power and powershift trans.
 
I think every company has its lemons. I know a neighbor who has a 190xt with over 20000hours
yes 20000 hours with original engine and tranny. He takes care of his equipment.
That's pretty darn good for feeding cows.
I have several high hour 190's and d-19' diesels and they work well. The lemons are the ones that people complain about. will they do the work of a d21, no. but they will still do a pile of work and have a long wheelbase unlike other brands.
the fact that the d19d's are over 50 years old and still running strong shows their build quality. you can steer the tractor with one finger and it rides like a Cadillac compared to
a WD 45 or a WC. The engine in that d19 also sipps fuel compared to everything else.
It had the head pinned before I got it, it was clearly ahead of its time, still doing work over 50 years later! I dare think no modern tractors will be doing that in 2067!
they have a beautiful exhaust tone with a straight pipe and if the pump and injectors are proper they burn as clean as any other diesel.
 
Both the D-19 and the XT190 early ones had problems. But the latter ones where pretty good but the bugs had to be worked out of them
 

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